A whiter shade of pale......

Golgother

Golgother

Hero member
Hello Folks,
JL's excellent Laverdamania lists two seperate Ral numbers for Laverda Orange, Ral 2010 and Ral 2008.
I plumped for Ral 2008.....I`ve had a sample component painted and it looks very nice, however , it is definitely a couple of shades lighter than any of the nefarious hues of orange that are on my SFC [which appears to have been painted from 4 different paint pots!], and it is also lighter than any of the orange machines in Ray Shone's garage, including an original ,never repainted SFC and an original, never repainted Jota.
I`ve checked the painted component against colour samples of Ral 2008 from two different paint manufacturers and its an exact match, so I`m happy that I`ve got an accurate batch of Ral 2008. Has anybody had any experience of this?
I`m not anal about this sort of stuff and am quite happy to go with what i`ve got, but I was just curious as to whether there was known to be a significantly 'lighter' shade of Laverda orange.
Bob
 
<DIV>Hi Bob,</DIV> <DIV>         I,m no expert but over time paint will age - the shade will change due to sunlight,type of wax used, T- Cut etc</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Orange Days</DIV> <DIV>      Andy B</DIV>
 
<DIV>Hi Bob,</DIV> <DIV>Not only the shade changes with age but also the RAL references indicated in the website are the most approaching colour to the original paint which doesn't exist anymore, not exactly the same. Consequently, this is very difficult, probably quite impossible, to get exactly the same shade than original, as for any original Laverda paint.</DIV> <DIV>Anyway, 2008 is slightly lighter than 2010, the correct colour should be somewhere between them.</DIV> <DIV>JLO</DIV>
 
<DIV>Hey lads.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>    What about ORANGE, but backwards, spray your bike EGNARO..Man !!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>                           who rolled this anyway ?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>                                        Tim</DIV>
 
Hi JLO,
It's all a bit subjective really. I felt that the 2010 was a nice strong orange, but in the end I went for 2008 because I felt it would provide the nicest match/contrast to the Lancia Blue go- faster stripe that the work's bikes had. For years I thought these stripes were black and it was only when I saw a works bike in the flesh that I realised it was dark blue. Piero confirmed that it was a Lancia Blue.....and there's about 6 different shades of that! In the end I picked a Lancia Blue dating from the early seventies [a Fulvia colour I think].
I have a feeling that the race bikes were painted in whatever shade was lying around that looked nearly right...anyway, mines going to be in painted in Ral 2008!
Thanks, bob
 
What paint do Laverda Corse use?

Is it just some pot they have hanging around somewhere to have fixed the V6 fairing after its off the other year - or have they run out by now?

If Piero could tell us what they use - or give someone a little tin of it - the paint specialists could match it surely?

My two penn'orth...

--
Dick
 
Have some direct knowledge of this topic.

When i painted the Jota here orange bought a litre of Sikkens 2K RAL2008 and a litre of RAL2010, not understanding it is over $100 a litre! Also a litre of frame Silver, the later silver was matched to an oem silver frame i had here. The Orange was not matched but bought as a recommended colour match. For the orange comparison i have an oem 81 Jota tank including oem tape pin strips.

As with many manufactured items there is a trade off between cost and appearence, cost usualy being the most important in mass manufacture. To the paint outcome on the tank ( large items give you a better "look" for colour pleasing factor. The RAL2008 was for sure too light in colour saturation or shade. Pleasent though it was as a stand alone colour if you like lighter colours. Nothing for it then, over the top of the RAL2008 i shoot the RAL2010 several coats to better refelect the true saturation of the RAL2010. Close to the oem 81 Jota tank ( cleaned paint surface on underside of tank for best match ).

Come the late evening light and the various items painted with both orange colours and the factory oem are looked at. This colour "match" thing is highly dependent on many things, the saturation colour in different light is amazing, completly different, even oem painted at factory coloured parts.

If you want close to oem factory colour then RAL2010 is the closest i have seen so far, however the 26 year old low cost paint used by the factory has well and truely changed "shade" over the years and in the end what is factory colours, then or now?

The frame silver of the factory is a paint easly removed from the frames, not what you call well coated though serviceable of the era. Best match for me came as Sikkens 2K Coarse Metalic 333CS 777+ what these numbers mean i have no understanding as yet. This silver was a great match and looked the business, though i did not clear over base the final paint session. Something the test pilot complains about on a regular basis, for while the base silver is identical to factory silver ( 1979 frame ) it is not so easly cleaned from road use as the COB ( Clear Over Base ) frame of the other 81 Jota here ( painted in 2K at college around 2002 ). This lack of COB is also what i did for the orange parts to keep something like an original appearence, the tape pinstrips are becoming damaged just like on the original unrestores tank i have. For sure COB would prevent a lot of the damage to the orange and silver parts i have painted, for if you want original appearence then you get all that goes with it, as the statement above indicates cost to produce governs the outcome not what is best serviceable for the next 30 years.

The above is basicly what JLO is saying expanded and for the reasons that happened to me when this painting was undertaken.

Next paint job is going to be in the 120Jota red of 1982, have similar colour on parts here for the match. To COB or not.....mmm..

HTH John
 
Hi John,
Something no one has mentioned yet, is the influence that the underlining primer has on the final look of the paint. Even people in the business occassionally forget to match the primer. This will be most noticeable when doing spot repairs. The color of the paint, thickness, number of coats, type of paint, type of spraygun, all can effect the final look and shade to some extent. Primer choice can have the largest effect in a lot of cases, and yet vehicle paint codes normally do not give this info.

Will
 
Will, you are absolutely right, the 2008 goes on with white primer, which is why I think it's looks quite light.
Whilst Ducati red [for instance] goes on over pink primer which is why it looks so rich. The other influence, rarely acknowledged, is the quality of natural light. Colours will look very different under the bright sun of the Southern Hemisphere than they will under the grey skies of my native Northern England.
Regards, Bob
 
<DIV>Hi Will, I had a car painted Ferrari red (no, it wasn't a Ferrari...:-), the painter put a golden primer, he said that it was the original primer used by Ferrari, do you confirm? And also once the red had dried, it became quite orange! This was only when the clear base was sprayed and dried that the colour came to red...</DIV> <DIV>JLO</DIV>
 
Hello JLO,
I no longer work in the automotive field, so am unable to comment on the Ferrari primer. I will note that the closer you get to the red end of the spectrum, the more critical primer color gets. And, generally, red paints are the most expensive, usually at least 50% minimum over others. Further note on primers: When I refered to paint codes, I was thinking what is noted on the vehicle info stickers/emblems. The factory dealers generally will have this info, but you will have to do some digging to find it. Sometimes, an automotive paint store will have it listed in their feference books, sometimes not. May depend on the brand of paint that they stock. Also, except for a very few standard colors, any paint you buy would be custom mixxed. You would be amazed at the proportions of some of the ingredients. I can recall putting as little as 6 drops of one color as part of a gallon mix. You start with the smallest components first. Mixxing/stirring is very important. Never accept paint that has not been put on the stores shaker/mixxer!

Will
 
Hello Will,
Thank you for the pointers on paint and undercoats, the commercial paint supplier for Sikkens was very helpful and did use the Sikkens graded tint undercoat system for me. Ment i had to buy specific undercoats for the various colours, ended up costing more than AUS$700 for paint alone. Gun here is a nice Anest Iwata 1,2m/m gravity fed.

Light in Australia is very bright as Bob mentions, can be very harsh on paints and improper tinted paint mixs ie faded colours.

As for what the industry do in practise i was very fortunate to be able to visit the Technical College vehicle paint section where apprentices were trained by 30+ experience painters, whom showed me the colour chips from books that stacked 3 feet high! So many colours and so many ways to tint to the colour desired. Will let JLO know what they come up with for the 82 120Jota Red.

John
 
<DIV>Hi All,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I would dearly love to know what the code for the Jota 120 red is also and of course undercoat. </DIV> <DIV>I believe that it is Ferrari/Fiat Rosso, though I have been known to be wrong once or twice. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Simon.</DIV>
 
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